Skip to content

1 Tim 2 notes

November 16, 2007

1Tim 2:11-12 Let the woman (gune) learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman (gune) to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man (aner), but to be in silence.

The instructions of the passage reflect God’s loving and protective heart for HIS daughters.

The word for “usurp authority” is unique and implies very forceful behavior carrying the meaning: absolute master; murderous; autocratic.

The reason God says it is not because a woman/wife is inferior, deceived, can’t teach.
It is for her own protection!!!

I seriously considered whether 1 Tim 2:11-15 is instructions on how to run a MARRIAGE.

In greek there are not separate words for “husband” and “man” nor for “wife” and “woman”. The greek “aner” is translated husband or man and the greek “gune” is translated wife or woman. The discretion/interpretation of the translator comes to bear on HOW it is translated in each case.

Could this be a parallel passage?
1Cor 14:35 where the translators chose “husbands” in this case:
“And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women(WIVES) to speak in the church.”

And I think 1 Pet 3:1-6 (though written by Peter) could be a parellel instruction on how to handle a (difficult) marriage.
A husband will simply not listen nor hear a wife who is finger wagging didactic nor attempting to forcefully exercise authority over him. It is counterproductive for a wife to deal with a husband in a manner which comes across as “parental”. It won’t “fix him”. To the contrary; he will- at least- dig in his heels if he doesn’t get downright abusive. God knows that!

The instructions of the passage reflect God’s loving and protective heart for HIS daughters.

This is from the Interlinear Bible (which directly translates the greek text into English):

1Tim 2:14-15 interlinear

Adam not was-deceived the but woman being-deceived in transgression has-become;
She-will-be-saved but through the childbearing if they-remain in faith and love and holiness with sensibleness

Here’s the KJV translation at Blue Letter Bible. One can click C in the right column and look at the strong’s definition of each word. I did that.

1Tim 2:15 interlinear
She-will-be-saved but through the childbearing if they-remain

I don’t think the detail here is trivial nor accidental.

she- singular
THE child bearing- definite article
THEY- plural

Who is “she”?
Who is “the child” being born or begotten?
Who are “they”?

and what does “she shall be saved” mean?

BLB- she shall be saved

It can’t be salvation through Jesus because it is conditional upon the actions of whoever “they” are. “IF THEY continue in ….”

some of the meanings of saved are – made well, healed, restored

she shall be saved(made well, healed, restored) if they continue in fidelity, holiness, love

“she” could be the wife, Eve, woman, ?????
“they” could be the husband and wife, the children, women, ?????

“the child bearing” could be
-the formation of Christ within her, or
-physical bearing of offspring.

The salvation cannot be Christian salvation because it is conditional upon the behavior of “they”.

I think “she” refers to Eve.

I think “they” refers to women (all women who continue in faith, love, holiness whether single, married, childless, etc.)

So, this is the rendering which I think reflects the meaning of the verse:

She (Eve) will be saved (restored) through bearing the child if they (women) continue in…

will be saved/restored” is in the future.
Restored HOW?
I think it refers to the verse before*

I think in any woman who allows Jesus to be formed in her and “continues in…” is restored to the garden state of intimacy with the LORD (as Eve enjoyed before the transgression).

 

Quote:

1Tim 2:14-15 interlinear

Adam not was-deceived the but woman being-deceived in transgression has-become*;

She-will-be-saved but through the childbearing if they-remain in faith and love and holiness with sensibleness

I take it as a message of hope, healing, restoration for women.
It is not meant to demean, disrespect, muzzle, or put down women!!!
My GOD is NOT LIKE THAT!
And nothing in HIS WORD will do that!
That is my starting premise for reading scripture.

I think this is some parallel preaching by Paul:

 

Quote:

quote: Gal 4: 19 ¶ My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,
20 I desire to be present with you now, and to change my voice; for I stand in doubt of you.
21 ¶ Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
1 ¶ Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

As far as personal application goes…
I have seen the section of 1 tim 2 as applicable to the porn problem facing the church today; 2 tim 3:1ff is also striking in its relevance.
Whatever contemporary situation Paul was addressing must have had much overlap with the modern church, AND I believe God’s Word to be “living and active” in a very deep and mysterious sense those words were NOT just written to and for a church 2000 years ago, but for us today.

‘men lift up HOLY hands in every place…”
“women dress MODESTLY…”
the fall/ the deception of Eve
“but she shall be saved(RESTORED) through the childbearing if they continue faith, love and holiness with propriety”

Do you see how all that can speak into the modern porn problem?

The porn problem is extremely disruptive to the intimacy in a marriage.
1 Tim 2 speaks to that:
-for the wife to LEARN- steep herself in GOD and HIS WORD,
-not to treat her husband in an “authentein” way, attempts to armtwist him are futile and counterproductive,
-to dress modestly,
-to continue being a help MEET to her husband with “faith, love and holiness with propriety”.
-Christ will be formed in her- “the childbirth” and her garden intimacy with the Lord will be restored- in that sense- REVERSING EVE.

It is a promise, a passage of HOPE, HEALING, DELIVERANCE, and RESTORATION!
It isn’t intended to club women into silence.
Using it that way is misuse- and in the extreme, can even descend to spiritual abuse.
…which is not a good representation of our LORD, Jesus Christ whom we serve.

to continue from my previous post…
I see parallels with the 1 Peter 3 instructions for wives of disobedient husbands. “without a word” “he may be won”.
In both passages, she is to press deeply into the LORD and learn from HIM. 1 Peter 3 talks about “the hidden person of her heart”
and what a precious treasure that is to her LORD.

Thus, she will grow so that her behavior, her demeanor- in Christ- is above reproach. And she will be a good example, a light, a help MEET for her husband. It is a high and holy CALLING.

and 1 Tim 2 is not JUST for “in church”. It is for every where (see 1 Tim 2:8)

Once one grasps that it is for “every where”, one will need to throw out the traditional understanding as a restriction upon every christian woman having any authority over any man. To do otherwise, and function in a free society, would be hypocrisy.

I used to try to live consistently with the traditional understanding of the passage and avoid any authority over any man in any context. Even then, I know I fell short of perfect practice of my understanding of the passage. How? Well, I voted and women voting is an exercise of authority over men. SO, to practice no authority over any man EVERY WHERE would mean women cannot vote, nor could they work outside the home in very many contexts, nor could they teach high school nor college

Advertisements
No comments yet

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: